It seems to me that the Jedi follow the four Platonic virtues: prudence, temperance, courage and justice.
I suspect the Jedi don't fear hate. I think they understand their courage and strength comes from their faith and belief in the Force. I am one with the Force and the Force is one with me :)
Merci for your kind words and I suspect the same thing with regards to the Four Platonic Virtues.
As to whether they fear hatred, this depends I think Jedi to Jedi, but as a general rule I think there is fear there if in the sense of they have a healthy respect for it that said yes their strength does indeed come from faith & belief in the Force :)
“Peace over anger. Honour over hate. Strength over fear.”
These don't seem right to me. Here is what I think.
Peace and anger. The antidote to anger is discipline of the self, not peace which is an effect not something an individual can control. Unless it is some kind of inner peace.
Honour and hate. The counterbalance to hate is not honour, it is understanding. Insight into their mindset, to understand where they have went wrong.
Strength and fear. I can see a link here, but the emphasis is wrong. The strong can resist fear, but it is really courage that does the job.
So, “Discipline over anger. Insight over hate. Courage over fear.”
Fair enough hahaha, I think though that the idea of Peace is supposed to have connotations with self-discipline here and insight and honour go hand in hand just as Strength and Courage can be linked.
But you do raise some good points Spaceman, I think you raise some good points.
I disagree. If someone hates you because of your ethnicity, for example, is it useful to use love to counteract this? Insight into their mindset goes a lot further. Maybe they have a skewed view of you or your group, maybe they are crazy. Maybe they just hate everyone. Liking them back won't help.
Star Wars is a lot of fun. But this is why we shouldn't take it too seriously.
While hatred is a vice, anger is not. If you don't feel anger over a little child being abused, something is wrong with you -- you're a bad person and less likely to work for justice on behalf of that child. Or if you simply claim not to feel anger, holding it in, you're just turning yourself into an emotional time bomb and prolonging your own suffering with denial.
Strength is not the opposite of fear, as fear is not a weakness. Fear is a perfectly reasonable response to many situations. We would be in trouble without it. The opposite of fear is love. While fear repels, love draws near. Yeah, George, I'm sorry you went through a bad divorce, but attachments are not evil. People who can't form attachments have disorders rooted in child abuse and are likely to behave like sociopaths or psychopaths.
This is also a list of absolutes. Which is actually good -- truth is absolute. But you can't say only Sith deal in absolutes then, because that in itself is an absolute statement.
Good point, about the trouble with absolutes and anger and fear, I'm not sure George was trying to say attachment is evil, quite the contrary. Seems he was arguing against it with his SW universe.
I believe you've forgotten about the one Jedi, sith, and Jedi again that would have understood that the Jedi Code was flawed.
You've forgotten Revan. The one who embraced both sides of the force and found his own balance.
Sadly, the Jedi slowly divorced themselves from the people of the galaxy and retreated to the temple in the center of the Empire, I mean republic and never sought to create a better, more evolved Jedi.
In a perfect universe, Jedi would have been businessmen, laborers, builders, designers, farmers, and bounty hunters, using the force to help in daily tasks.
Maybe someday when I have more time, I will address this more fully, but for now I will just say that it should be "reason over anger". Peace is a deception. The caged bird has peace. Freedom is preferable to peace and in fact peace is often antithetical to freedom. We have to fight to achieve freedom, for the world is full of those who would control us, and we have to fight to keep that freedom, for those controllers lose their power when we are free.
“Do Jedi have tempers, oh heck yeah but what is the secret to their goodness? That they maintain incredible self-discipline and calm, where others might resort first to anger and conflict.”
It all seems good at first glance. But the ultimate problem is Truth. If you don't start with the fullness of Truth, the ultimate in Truth, the one who IS Truth, then your paradigm is messed up from the start. It can't help but be irretrievable.
To an extent, though I would see it as when there's fewer of one side the stronger it is. For example in Kotor 1 & 2, Jedi Academy games, there's more Sith than there are Jedi, and in the Last of the Jedi books where Ferus Olin is the last Jedi, he proves stronger than both Vader & Sidious expected. Truth is in Star Wars hatred is weaker than resolve.
The trouble with matching hate for hate, is that it drags everyone down, as you are still hating. I think in Star Wars, the idea is to dislike evil sure, but to defeat it with a clear mind and with honour and love. Love is stronger than hatred so when the Jedi tap that, they become unstoppable.
And that does sound like a great story! I myself am pushing some of the themes of Revenge bad and honour good in my stories, and think that Schlichter's story sounds interesting. Will look it up.
Interesting read! Thank you!
It seems to me that the Jedi follow the four Platonic virtues: prudence, temperance, courage and justice.
I suspect the Jedi don't fear hate. I think they understand their courage and strength comes from their faith and belief in the Force. I am one with the Force and the Force is one with me :)
Merci for your kind words and I suspect the same thing with regards to the Four Platonic Virtues.
As to whether they fear hatred, this depends I think Jedi to Jedi, but as a general rule I think there is fear there if in the sense of they have a healthy respect for it that said yes their strength does indeed come from faith & belief in the Force :)
Once again I find myself disagreeing with this:
“Peace over anger. Honour over hate. Strength over fear.”
These don't seem right to me. Here is what I think.
Peace and anger. The antidote to anger is discipline of the self, not peace which is an effect not something an individual can control. Unless it is some kind of inner peace.
Honour and hate. The counterbalance to hate is not honour, it is understanding. Insight into their mindset, to understand where they have went wrong.
Strength and fear. I can see a link here, but the emphasis is wrong. The strong can resist fear, but it is really courage that does the job.
So, “Discipline over anger. Insight over hate. Courage over fear.”
🤓
Fair enough hahaha, I think though that the idea of Peace is supposed to have connotations with self-discipline here and insight and honour go hand in hand just as Strength and Courage can be linked.
But you do raise some good points Spaceman, I think you raise some good points.
I still maintain it is all bad writing by hacks, lol.
I may like some of it, but I do understand where your coming from on this one.
or bad philosophy
No the counterbalance of hate is love.
There is that
I disagree. If someone hates you because of your ethnicity, for example, is it useful to use love to counteract this? Insight into their mindset goes a lot further. Maybe they have a skewed view of you or your group, maybe they are crazy. Maybe they just hate everyone. Liking them back won't help.
Breadsticks
?
Exactly
Star Wars is a lot of fun. But this is why we shouldn't take it too seriously.
While hatred is a vice, anger is not. If you don't feel anger over a little child being abused, something is wrong with you -- you're a bad person and less likely to work for justice on behalf of that child. Or if you simply claim not to feel anger, holding it in, you're just turning yourself into an emotional time bomb and prolonging your own suffering with denial.
Strength is not the opposite of fear, as fear is not a weakness. Fear is a perfectly reasonable response to many situations. We would be in trouble without it. The opposite of fear is love. While fear repels, love draws near. Yeah, George, I'm sorry you went through a bad divorce, but attachments are not evil. People who can't form attachments have disorders rooted in child abuse and are likely to behave like sociopaths or psychopaths.
This is also a list of absolutes. Which is actually good -- truth is absolute. But you can't say only Sith deal in absolutes then, because that in itself is an absolute statement.
Good point, about the trouble with absolutes and anger and fear, I'm not sure George was trying to say attachment is evil, quite the contrary. Seems he was arguing against it with his SW universe.
Peace over anger Honour over hate strength over fear
Love this adage.
Liked by the Brothers krynn
Merci!
I believe you've forgotten about the one Jedi, sith, and Jedi again that would have understood that the Jedi Code was flawed.
You've forgotten Revan. The one who embraced both sides of the force and found his own balance.
Sadly, the Jedi slowly divorced themselves from the people of the galaxy and retreated to the temple in the center of the Empire, I mean republic and never sought to create a better, more evolved Jedi.
In a perfect universe, Jedi would have been businessmen, laborers, builders, designers, farmers, and bounty hunters, using the force to help in daily tasks.
Fair enough, though I think Revan embraced more the light after Kotor 1.
Good point
Maybe someday when I have more time, I will address this more fully, but for now I will just say that it should be "reason over anger". Peace is a deception. The caged bird has peace. Freedom is preferable to peace and in fact peace is often antithetical to freedom. We have to fight to achieve freedom, for the world is full of those who would control us, and we have to fight to keep that freedom, for those controllers lose their power when we are free.
Agree, freedom is worth fighting for and reason is better than anger.
“Do Jedi have tempers, oh heck yeah but what is the secret to their goodness? That they maintain incredible self-discipline and calm, where others might resort first to anger and conflict.”
Literally something Anakin could never do. 😂
Sadly true
It all seems good at first glance. But the ultimate problem is Truth. If you don't start with the fullness of Truth, the ultimate in Truth, the one who IS Truth, then your paradigm is messed up from the start. It can't help but be irretrievable.
Good point, there definitely should have been a fourth line; Truth over Deception or something.
To an extent, though I would see it as when there's fewer of one side the stronger it is. For example in Kotor 1 & 2, Jedi Academy games, there's more Sith than there are Jedi, and in the Last of the Jedi books where Ferus Olin is the last Jedi, he proves stronger than both Vader & Sidious expected. Truth is in Star Wars hatred is weaker than resolve.
The trouble with matching hate for hate, is that it drags everyone down, as you are still hating. I think in Star Wars, the idea is to dislike evil sure, but to defeat it with a clear mind and with honour and love. Love is stronger than hatred so when the Jedi tap that, they become unstoppable.
Very much agree!
And that does sound like a great story! I myself am pushing some of the themes of Revenge bad and honour good in my stories, and think that Schlichter's story sounds interesting. Will look it up.
Ah I see
Actually no, I don't know many others sorry