To say that Qui-Gon Jinn is popular among some is something that goes without saying, and there is a reason for that. Qui-Gon is likeable, charming, funny and played by the always excellent and charismatic Liam Neeson. The trouble with the character is that the movies are but the tip of the iceberg where this man is concerned.
Wow, interesting. I mean... as someone who likes Qui-Gon, I don't how to feel about the EU making the character almost a 180 of how he was in the movies. But interesting nonetheless.
The talk about Qui (and Obi's) girlfriends made think about 'Jedi celibacy'. It seems the Jedi have a twisted understanding of celibacy. They think they must abstain from sex or "attachment" because it's evil. But the true celibate gives up sex/the married life not because it's evil but because it's good and so he gave them up for a greater good.
Personally, if I was in charge of the Jedi, I would instead institute a rule in which only celibates can be a member of the Jedi Council. So it would be like how in the Eastern Rites, married men can become priests but they can't be a bishop. I think there is merit in celibacy (irl monks do it, after all) and I understand that the Jedi have big responsibilities which may not gel well with family life. But given that most Jedi are one from birth, it's really not fair to expect them to abstain from marriage before they are old enough to choose that life for themselves (and I don't accept dumb libertarian "just leave the order bro" argument).
Wow. Great psychological profile of the characters. To me, what seems to be lacking, again, is genuine love, or agape Love. I hate to beat this horse to death but they're missing full revelation. Well, duh. How could they not? So they are perpetually unhappy. The Jedi are supposed to protect and remain chaste to do that but can never keep their pants on. And why? They have no higher plane or reason for their chastity other than worldly protection and everlasting loneliness. So they replace that with worldly versions of love. It's a sad existence for them. Contrast this with those who have given the gift of chastity to The Lord, in order to be united to Him, the source of ultimate Joy in this world and the next for all eternity. That makes sense. Or those who chose chastity to do the will of God to be joined with another on earth, for the same reason in heaven.
This is why I struggle with most plots. I can tolerate them, but they're ultimately empty.
I do agree, in the Prequel era the only one who seemed to have genuine agape or love was Obi-Wan, who truly loved Siri Tachi for example, and she him but the trouble is that she died in the war and he never truly recovered on some level and he came to rely on Anakin only for him to turn and for Obi-Wan to become broken by loss.
Great article, Bros Krynn! It reminds me a lot of academic literary criticism without the overwrought academese and sci-fi subject matter instead of "literary fiction," which, imho, is much more fun 😀
I definitely didn't know the deep lore on Qui-Gon, even after watching Clone Wars. Thanks for the deep dive! Excellent commentary!
Oh thanks, well I was I trained and worked in the academic world, notably I've studied literary criticism, and definitely agree with you that the overwrought academese is wearisome. And while I'm not a big Sci-Fi fan, I do have a soft spot for SW and Power-Rangers, and think the term 'literary fiction' a joke.
As to the lore regarding Qui-Gon, yeah I used to read the old Jedi Apprentice series quite a bit, but as it went on I found him a more and more over-zealous figure, and the opposite of someone who breaks the rules. It was funny, but as to Clone Wars I don't really like it, but instead prefer the movies or novelizations of them.
It was my pleasure to be informative, and I plan to make more articles like this, one for every character who appears in all the movies and the Jedi Knight series games, I can't wait to deep dive into Luke Skywalker, I love him as a character.
What I loved about Clone Wars was the fleshing out of the prequels. In some ways it explained why they didn't nearly hold up to the original Trilogy--trying to compress a long series into 3 features was too tall an order. At least that was my take. In a way, Lucas was true to form, being about two decades ahead of his time, as I think that series, written for a mature audience on a streaming service in live action, might be the best Star Wars of all. Mandalorian meets Clone Wars would be epic, but I doubt we'll ever see it.
I'm a rare beast who preferred the Prequels with their attendant books, more than the OT but to each their own. I find the Clone Wars to not be to my taste, but if you enjoyed it love what you love.
To an extent, however the Sith are definitely evil, and cruel, and most do not have a sense of humour. Only Dooku, and Vader in my experience have one, most others are lacking in that field (sadly).
What's strange is that in most depictions the Jedi are the ones with a sense of humour, though in Jinn's case he has a very wry one (I really do like it), but it's just that he kind of loses it over the course of Obi-Wan's time with him, so that by the time he's 25, it is Obi cracking wise and Jinn being annoyed at any display of humour.
Some Jedi who have an awesome sense of humour are Luke, Kyle, Obi-Wan, even Atton Rand, Anakin, Bao-Dur and Brianna oh and Jolee Bindo all have great senses of humour.
I must be watching shows about a different Sith order then, because the Sith, and the Galactic Empire they built as seen in Andor, do not seem a particularly accepting sort.
This was an interesting analysis. I haven't read the Jedi Apprentice series so this was new and interesting to me. Other than Obi Wan, who do you think would've been a good master for Anakin?
Plo Koon, Qui-Gon's Jinn's best friend would have been a better choice; patient, kind yet silently solicitous he would have better understood Anakin and would have also kept him firmly away from politicians like Padme & Palpatine.
There is also Siri Tachi, who had a personality just like Anakin's except she was far wiser, more level-headed and kindlier, though on the other hand she wasn't particularly fond of Jinn for what he had done to Obi-Wan. She would have ensured that his father figure be Obi-Wan and that Palps keeps his distance, just as she would have chosen a mate for Anakin, rather than letting him wander towards Padme. The thing about Siri is she would know exactly who might be good for Anakin.
These are about the only two Jedi who could have done well by Anakin, better than Obi-Wan. Obi-Wan could be sarcastic, condescending and even verbally abusive for a few years, and he was a little cranky as we could see in Ep 2, so while he started off good to Annie, he eventually after Anakin was about 15 developed some bad habits. But on the other hand, after he outgrew these bad habits, he became a doting father who was keen to almost smother Anakin with more love than Shmi ever did.
Wow, interesting. I mean... as someone who likes Qui-Gon, I don't how to feel about the EU making the character almost a 180 of how he was in the movies. But interesting nonetheless.
The talk about Qui (and Obi's) girlfriends made think about 'Jedi celibacy'. It seems the Jedi have a twisted understanding of celibacy. They think they must abstain from sex or "attachment" because it's evil. But the true celibate gives up sex/the married life not because it's evil but because it's good and so he gave them up for a greater good.
Personally, if I was in charge of the Jedi, I would instead institute a rule in which only celibates can be a member of the Jedi Council. So it would be like how in the Eastern Rites, married men can become priests but they can't be a bishop. I think there is merit in celibacy (irl monks do it, after all) and I understand that the Jedi have big responsibilities which may not gel well with family life. But given that most Jedi are one from birth, it's really not fair to expect them to abstain from marriage before they are old enough to choose that life for themselves (and I don't accept dumb libertarian "just leave the order bro" argument).
Is it true that in the Eastern Rite if you're already a priest you cannot marry?
That's my understanding. If you are married, you can still be ordained but you can't be an ordained priest then get married.
Okay, thanks. Peace.
Yeah, I didn't know that about the eastern rite, cool
Wow. Great psychological profile of the characters. To me, what seems to be lacking, again, is genuine love, or agape Love. I hate to beat this horse to death but they're missing full revelation. Well, duh. How could they not? So they are perpetually unhappy. The Jedi are supposed to protect and remain chaste to do that but can never keep their pants on. And why? They have no higher plane or reason for their chastity other than worldly protection and everlasting loneliness. So they replace that with worldly versions of love. It's a sad existence for them. Contrast this with those who have given the gift of chastity to The Lord, in order to be united to Him, the source of ultimate Joy in this world and the next for all eternity. That makes sense. Or those who chose chastity to do the will of God to be joined with another on earth, for the same reason in heaven.
This is why I struggle with most plots. I can tolerate them, but they're ultimately empty.
I do agree, in the Prequel era the only one who seemed to have genuine agape or love was Obi-Wan, who truly loved Siri Tachi for example, and she him but the trouble is that she died in the war and he never truly recovered on some level and he came to rely on Anakin only for him to turn and for Obi-Wan to become broken by loss.
I do love the Obi- wan character. That must be why.
Hahaha yeah
Great article, Bros Krynn! It reminds me a lot of academic literary criticism without the overwrought academese and sci-fi subject matter instead of "literary fiction," which, imho, is much more fun 😀
I definitely didn't know the deep lore on Qui-Gon, even after watching Clone Wars. Thanks for the deep dive! Excellent commentary!
Oh thanks, well I was I trained and worked in the academic world, notably I've studied literary criticism, and definitely agree with you that the overwrought academese is wearisome. And while I'm not a big Sci-Fi fan, I do have a soft spot for SW and Power-Rangers, and think the term 'literary fiction' a joke.
As to the lore regarding Qui-Gon, yeah I used to read the old Jedi Apprentice series quite a bit, but as it went on I found him a more and more over-zealous figure, and the opposite of someone who breaks the rules. It was funny, but as to Clone Wars I don't really like it, but instead prefer the movies or novelizations of them.
It was my pleasure to be informative, and I plan to make more articles like this, one for every character who appears in all the movies and the Jedi Knight series games, I can't wait to deep dive into Luke Skywalker, I love him as a character.
What I loved about Clone Wars was the fleshing out of the prequels. In some ways it explained why they didn't nearly hold up to the original Trilogy--trying to compress a long series into 3 features was too tall an order. At least that was my take. In a way, Lucas was true to form, being about two decades ahead of his time, as I think that series, written for a mature audience on a streaming service in live action, might be the best Star Wars of all. Mandalorian meets Clone Wars would be epic, but I doubt we'll ever see it.
Looking forward to learning more about Luke!
I'm a rare beast who preferred the Prequels with their attendant books, more than the OT but to each their own. I find the Clone Wars to not be to my taste, but if you enjoyed it love what you love.
It sounds like all the Jedi could use counseling on how to form attachments.
The Sith may be "Evil," but they have a sense of humor and form attachments.
The Jedi remind me of a cult. Meanwhile, the Sith reminds me of people accepting who they are.
To an extent, however the Sith are definitely evil, and cruel, and most do not have a sense of humour. Only Dooku, and Vader in my experience have one, most others are lacking in that field (sadly).
What's strange is that in most depictions the Jedi are the ones with a sense of humour, though in Jinn's case he has a very wry one (I really do like it), but it's just that he kind of loses it over the course of Obi-Wan's time with him, so that by the time he's 25, it is Obi cracking wise and Jinn being annoyed at any display of humour.
Some Jedi who have an awesome sense of humour are Luke, Kyle, Obi-Wan, even Atton Rand, Anakin, Bao-Dur and Brianna oh and Jolee Bindo all have great senses of humour.
I must be watching shows about a different Sith order then, because the Sith, and the Galactic Empire they built as seen in Andor, do not seem a particularly accepting sort.
This is an absolutely eye-opening and brilliant character evaluation!
Thanks and yeah, there's a lot going on between Qui-Gon & Obi-Wan, there's a lot one can write about them.
This was an interesting analysis. I haven't read the Jedi Apprentice series so this was new and interesting to me. Other than Obi Wan, who do you think would've been a good master for Anakin?
Plo Koon, Qui-Gon's Jinn's best friend would have been a better choice; patient, kind yet silently solicitous he would have better understood Anakin and would have also kept him firmly away from politicians like Padme & Palpatine.
There is also Siri Tachi, who had a personality just like Anakin's except she was far wiser, more level-headed and kindlier, though on the other hand she wasn't particularly fond of Jinn for what he had done to Obi-Wan. She would have ensured that his father figure be Obi-Wan and that Palps keeps his distance, just as she would have chosen a mate for Anakin, rather than letting him wander towards Padme. The thing about Siri is she would know exactly who might be good for Anakin.
These are about the only two Jedi who could have done well by Anakin, better than Obi-Wan. Obi-Wan could be sarcastic, condescending and even verbally abusive for a few years, and he was a little cranky as we could see in Ep 2, so while he started off good to Annie, he eventually after Anakin was about 15 developed some bad habits. But on the other hand, after he outgrew these bad habits, he became a doting father who was keen to almost smother Anakin with more love than Shmi ever did.
Thanks. I don't know much about Siri, but I agree with Plo Koon. One of the better Jedi. Peace.
Np, and yeah Plo was great, and peace you also mon ami